JBL Sub+Amp choices, which & need wiring upgrade?

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xty
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Post by xty » 02 Sep 2008, 6:11 pm

Since there are limited brands available in Dubai, I made some choices for the sub & amp of my car (Hyundai Tucson 2008). Since I still want to use the cargo trunk (spare tire compartment) or to simplify the installation (I'll try to do myself for first time if it's not so complicated), therefore I'm limited to enclosed box.

I'm thinking of either getting either:
- Sub JBL GTO1204BP-D (600w RMS, 1800w peak, dual 12")
- Amp JBL GTO1201.1 (1ch, 787w at 4 ohms, 1114w at 2 ohms)

or the lower spec, considering the budget:
- Sub JBL GTO1204BP (300w RMS, 1200w peak, the single version of above)
- Amp JBL GTO601.1 (1ch, 424w at 4 ohms, 580 at 2 ohms)

I'm kinda newbie to car & car audio (but have some knowledge of home electronics), first car first installation, so I need some suggestion. FYI, the head unit is Sony CDX-GT470U with 4x52w and sub/rear output, which I installed myself.

* Are those good pairs? I am not looking for highest end unit, but I need really good powerful bass, within the budget that is.
* The 2nd, powerful enough for my car?
* For the 1st, do I need to change power wires, ground wires, alternator, battery, etc? Will it void the car's warranty?
* Is capacitor (ex 1 Farad) better required?
* Will it hurt if for a moment (until I have the budget to get 4ch amp & JBL/Infinity speakers) for not to replace the factory speakers (front & rear)?
* Considering my first installation, is it easy to install by myself (to save some money on pro installer)? How the wire goes? Where to get the good amp cable kit & which gauge number?
* Will carpeting the trunk space be helpful?

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Neo
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Post by Neo » 02 Sep 2008, 10:49 pm

Welcome to the forum. I can see you are new.
And having a Hyundai Coupe makes us close buddies free of cost. :p

I appreciate you providing detailed information.
Normally we end up digging the specs ourselves to help anyone.

Alrite since it the coupe you can replace the HU and you have done that .
Sony does the job.

Since your Speakers are new keep them until you really feel they need to be changed.
Save the money and get a JBL 4 channel amp and JBL speakers later on.

Sub JBL GTO1204BP-D (600w RMS, 1800w peak, dual 12") <-- This will be enough for you.

Amp JBL GTO1201.1 (1ch, 787w at 4 ohms, 1114w at 2 ohms) <-- This will do the job.

GO for it dude.

Now pulling the wire from the battery could be a bit tricky as there isnt any normal path through firewall.
I had to drill a hole on the firewall and there is really less spots which needs to be picked smartly.

You can run a 4 Guage wire from the battery. (This will be enough for the Mono amp and the 4 channel in the future)
Upgrade the ground the wire from the battery to 4 guage. (Add an additional wire to the existing earth)
Get a branded kit from Naif, get the 4 Guage kit. Those silly billies might try to sell u 8 guage. Dont buy them.
You will have to run RCA cables from HU to back side.

Nobody is going to void the warranty. I have done crazy stuff and they didnt void mine.

But my concern is installation.
The work is straight forward but could be a bit tricky to anyone who isnt experienced.
Pulling the cable, Drilling hole if necessary, REmoving the Door sills, side panels etc..
A professional installer could do the job quickly.
Just tell him you need the work done as mentioned. (Watch the work and you will get some experience honestly)

If you are adamant to it yourself let me know I can try and provide some hints.

Honestly you dont need to spend on capacitors as you are in the safe zone.
Pro debate that capacitors are a waste and for SPL competitions they dont use capacitors.

You dont worry you will have powerfull bass with two woofers in a bandpass box... hehehe!!!

You will prolly install the amp on the back side of the rear seat.

The trunk of the coupe is fully covered with black carpet like thing. What are you talking about?

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xty
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Post by xty » 03 Sep 2008, 2:20 am

Thanks for the reply, Neo.

First, mine is Tucson (SUV type, as in my avatar) not Coupe, though we're still brothers :)

So the lower spec won't be enough? I guess I need to reach my wallet deeper as the box & sub alone will costs me about 2000 dhs. Hopefully it won't costs more than 3000 dhs in total. I'd like to spare some for the speakers upgrade, and my monthly grocery shopping. :D

I still have few doubts:
* Seeing the RMS rating, looks like the amp's is a little higher than the box. I'm afraid it will blow the sub. Will it?
* The connections: HU has 2 sub-out (RCA type) at the back. The amp has 2 RCA in (L/R) and 2 speaker-out terminals. The sub box has two speaker-in terminals. So I guess it will be straight L out of HU to L in of amp and R out of HU to R in of amp. Then one speaker out terminal of amp to one speaker in of the box, and so does the other. Correct me if I'm wrong.
* The HU has AMP REM cable. Is this the cable to be connected to the REM terminal of the amp (between power & ground)? Is it to turn on the amp when the HU is on? Or what?
* Remote Level Control: the amp is supplied with separate remote level control. Apart from volume, bass, treble, balance control, the HU has sub volume control too. How to use the sub volume control in the HU to control the level of the amp without (if possible) installing the amp's Remote Level Control unit?

About installation, I have some soft copy of User Manual and Hyundai Workshop Manual of the car (normally used by the service centers). And I'm get used to see instructions in building some stuffs (home electronics, furniture, etc), as long as all the necessary tools & stuffs are there. It could be challenging but also exciting. If something goes wrong, simply put them back as they were and wait for helps :)

So let me list the stuffs (shop list) required and please tell me if I miss something:

* Sub box as above. There could be problem accessing the spare tire & tools compartment. Hopefully I could still lift it up and unload it when in emergency (changing tire). It's said the weight is approx 50kg.
* Amp as above. I was thinking to install it on top of the box. The other 4ch amp (in future) for the speakers would be under the passenger seat, to get close to the doors.
* Good Amp wiring kit (4 gauge) including power cables, RCA cables, inline fuse+housing, speaker cables, connectors. How many meters? Any good enough brand available here (which doesn't break my wallet like Monster Cables) and approx price (avoiding being ripped off)? Last night I went to Auto Plus in Deira. Though they have some 4 gauge wiring kit, I didn't see good brand there.
* Carpeting the trunk. The trunk floor & sides are really all plastics including the spare tire compartment lid. So I guess it's minimum requirement?
* Sound dampening the trunk floor & tail gate. While it could help to install on doors when upgrading the speakers, is it really matter much when installing sub box in the open trunk of SUV? I saw Dynamat 20sqft costs 590 dhs.
* All the handy & electrical tools. Any special tools required and necessary?

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Neo
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Post by Neo » 03 Sep 2008, 3:43 pm

To avoid confusion I will try to keep my answers short and organized.
:)

1) It was late nite and when i saw tucson, my mind read it as tuscani... :)

2) Lower specs on woofer and amps would do just fine, but a month later you will be thinking I should have gone higher. This happens with everyone. The current recommended specs is good and listenable.

3) Just go for the SUB, AMP, Cable kit for now and upgrade the rest (amps and speakers) in another couple of months. Its always nice to have something to look forward to.

4) Having the RMS value of the amp a bit higher than the subs make sure that the subs get the required power all the time. Under powering the sub is a terrible idea. You are in the safe zone. You wont prolly have the clipping even when you play high volume.

5) RCA cable consists of a pair of wires (Left + Right) together. This will avoid confusion. So you have one Pre out from the HU (One left and one right). In that case you are right. The left from the HU goes into the left of the AMP and vice versa.

6) Regarding the speaker wire. Could you tell me how many inputs does the speaker box have? I guess there must be two inputs per speaker to enable series and parallel connections. In this case we need to calculate the impedance and work accordingly.

7) Another point left out yesterday which is normal is the REM wire. Remote activation. You need to pull the single wire all the way from HU to the amp and plug it to the remote port in the amp.

8 ) I recommend installing remote sub control in the car. Lay the wire from the AMP to the dashboard someplace where you can access it easily. This helps in tweaking the sub to your listening pleasure. The one is the unit will be set at a level becoz when you get the 4 channel amp. We will be splitting the RCA into another four channel using splitter. At that point if your use the HU's bass control, it wil inturn mess up the speaker output too. If you didnt understand this point let me know.

9) You should see my car, my enclosure takes up almost the entire trunk but Still i can access the spare tire. You could prolly place the enclosure all the way to the back of ur seat and make sure it stays there. When you have access spare tire. Fold the rear seats forward and push the box over the folded seat. So wire accordingly and do couple of trials. Make sure the box wouldnt move around in the car while driving. You have to securely mount it. Otherwise in a heavy braking you will have a 50 KG box flying at ur head.

10) Do not touch the box, dont drill or screw it. Later on that hole will remain and screw up the box. If you dont like back seat mounting then get a 3/4 Inch MDF which has the same dimension of the top of your box. Cover it with the same material as the box. Then stick it on the box using powerful double side stick tape and mount the amp on the MDF. So you can change it or remove it later on.

11) You can install the second amp under passenger seat. But normally people dont go around and splice the factory wiring or mess around with the connection from the body to the doors. They are done is such a way to avoid jamming of cables and water entry. What is normally done, the speaker wires from the amp is pulled all the way back to the HU. Then its connected to the speaker wires that goes out from the HU. And the Speakers wires are disconnected from HU. So if you place the amps together. You can pull all the cables together instead of loops.

12) As Long as it is 4 guage the brand doesnt matter. No crappy brands tries to sell 4 guage. Becoz its expensive and picked up by people who knows what is the difference between 4 and 8. They normally try to quick sell an 8 guage. I almost picked up the Kicker kit for 300 Bucks. You might find a brand called Absolute. (its okay) You dont have to buy monster cables. Honestly.

13) Carpeting the trunk makes it look more upclass. But then you better give it to someone who knows the job. You can easily make it look worse than it is now.

14) Sound proofing is another story. Its a tedious and long process. What I would recommend is to install the system and see if you really need sound proofing. If you need it you can either cover individual panel which rattle a lot or do complete sound proofing.

15) 20 SQ ft can do nothing, I used more than 50 SQ ft and couldnt complete my rear part. Picture are coming up soon. For my car I think 100 - 150 SQ ft will do fine. And for you roughly 150 - 200 could do well. The problem is many panels require two or three layers. My rear fenders inners required 4 layers to remove the flexing. If you need I can get you the band that I used. FAT Mat 50 SQ feet for Dhs 700. Inscase you need only 25 SQ feet that would be roughly Dhs 350.

Be very careful when you are pulling the powerwires becoz if you do something wrong the entire wiring can burn ur car.
Follow the instruction manual of the amp precisely and you will be safe.

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SALSABOI
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Post by SALSABOI » 04 Sep 2008, 7:30 pm

Neo wrote:To avoid confusion I will try to keep my answers short and organized.
lol wth .. I think you meant short OR organized coz that post is definitely organized but not short! :P

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Neo
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Post by Neo » 05 Sep 2008, 4:36 am

You know what salsaboi... after typing all that rubbish.. i felt exactly the same way as u.
But didnt retract my statement becoz it rhymes pretty well.
:)

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hater999
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Post by hater999 » 05 Sep 2008, 3:11 pm

Does are some big replies!!!



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